Florida Outcome

[registeredrepublican]

What happens when a president gets elected in years ending with zero (which of course happens only every 20 years)?



1840: William Henry Harrison (Died in Office)

1860: Abraham Lincoln (Assassinated)

1880: James A. Garfield (Assassinated)

1900: William McKinley (Assassinated)

1920: Warren G. Harding (Died in Office)

1940: Franklin D. Roosevelt (Died in Office)

1960: John F. Kennedy (Assassinated)

1980: Ronald Reagan (Barely Survived Assassination Attempt and left suffering from Alzheimer's)



Perhaps, whoever loses Florida shouldn't protest too much.

[goldenearring]

Looks like we have a change in the pattern.

I say . . .



2000:  George W. Bush (successfully gets this country back in touch with its roots, and with each other, and lives to complete a glorious second term, dies peacefully, in his sleep, when he is ready in about 40 years)  -  tall order, but I am an idealist, at heart.

 

[laundryhater]

Heard this joke from a stand-up comedian over the weekend:



Do you know why it took Orange County, Florida so long to count the votes?



Because Orange County is full of OLD people. Ya know how old people drive so slow and hold up traffic?



Well, now old people in Florida have found a way to slow down the whole f**ing COUNTRY!!

[chris68]

Hey GE, I like that idea.  Sounds Great to me.



Chris68

 

[yankeestarbuck]

How do we get a country comprised mostly by immigrants, some who stole land from and murdered the indiginous population, and some who were kidnapped and brought here by force to be slaves, in touch with it's roots?  Sounds hideous and violent, if you ask me.  Just a thought.

[goldenearring]

Remember, I'm an idealist, Yankeestarbuck.  The roots I mean are the foundational ones that this country was based on.  Granted, they are solid Christian principles, and many of them have been grossly abused and misrepresented over the years by those who insist they are doing "God's work" and "walking in love."  But when the principles are correctly applied the way that they were originally intended, miracles happen and people come together.  (No, not everybody, but more than would have come together than if the principles had not been applied, after all we are humans with free choice.)  



Yes, there have been gross injustices over the years, and there are probably more injustices to come, but where would you rather live than in the U.S.?  The roots I speak of is the truth that all men ARE created equal and while they all have different obstacles (some MUCH larger than others) to overcome, they still have the best opportunity to create a life they can enjoy and be proud of in this country, moreso than any other in the world.  Not enough time/space to elaborate fully on all these thoughts, but should you care to continue this conversation, you just let me know!  I love this country, I love God, and I love the thought that if everybody could find a way to see people as people instead of all the various things we see them as, we might actually get somewhere *really* good.  

 

[yankeestarbuck]

Your roots are great.  But that might not be what Mr. Bush has in mind.  And to be honest, religion and politics should never mix.  You probably have so much to gain from you religion, but it does nothing for me.  And if we're equal, I can't let my religion affect you and yours shouldn't affect me.  It's great that our president is a Christian, but what about all the US citizens who are  Catholic and Jewish and Muslim and Hindu and Buddhist and Taoist and Pagan and Wiccan and even those who worship Satan and don't believe in a god at all.  They should get equal consideration, as is afforded you and me.  Instead of going back and repeating history, which we've seen is a disaster, why not move forward and set down new roots as a country and society?  Instead of a melting pot where everything looks the same and is one bland flavor and color, let our counrty become a vibrand salad, all mixed together but each individual flavor and color coming out to announce itself in harmony with the rest?  Because to be honest, this country started off all half-a$$ed anyway.  It was begun by slave owners who wanted to be free.  And the original settlers were Puritans who wanted religious freedom, then began burning people they didn't like...getting rid of the undesireables (like Nazi Germany, yes?).  Granted, we've come along way since humans owning other humans, and burning them, and we need to keep moving forward.  Now THAT's true idealism.



And no, this is the only country I would live in because of the freedoms we have and it's the freedom that I have to say this that is most treasured by me.

[goldenearring]

I agree that religion should never mix with politics.  I don't believe in religion, either (a different set of rules for everybody, "Catholic religion" "Lutheran religion" etc.)  I believe that faith in God belongs in all aspects of society, however.  I believe that people who say they don't believe in God are lying, regardless of how forcefully they deny it; I believe that they *hope* there isn't a God so they can justify ignoring what he has to say about human beings in general and the way we ought to live their lives.  (Don't go reading anymore than what I just said into that statement.  Everyone has a good idea of where they stand with God, in my opinion, and only they know what they need to do to "get right" with Him.  It is not up to me to criticize, condemn or judge another because of my misguided notion that I am more spiritually enlightened; that *always* leads to a downfall of one sort or another.  We've all got our own, special set of problems to overcome and only God knows how to help each one of us, individually.  It's a personal relationship type of thing that each person has to come to grips with - - like the natural and spiritual laws that rule this universe we live in.  And, I believe that each person only gets so many chances to take care of his/her business with God before it is too late.  It is, in some respects, similar to our getting only so many chances to take care of ourselves physically, before it is too late.)  There was a polygraphic study done and, of course, I don't have the details but in it, time after time, without fail, EVERYBODY, even atheists, when answering the question, "Do you believe there is a God?" made the needle go off the chart (as in what they believed and what they said didn't jibe).  (This study was referred to by Zig Ziglar in an audiocassette program I recently listened to.  I have no doubt in the integrity of Mr. Ziglar; however, I realize not everyone even knows who he is so they may not be as persuaded.  Everything else here is strictly my viewpoint of things.)  Even Darwin denounced most of his theories on evolution shortly before his death as being the ramblings of an arrogant young man.  Darwin died a Christian.  He recognized that, in all of life, there are certain "rules"/"laws"/"whatever you want to call them" that govern the existence of every single human being, and you either get it or you don't (or you "won't" (an act of free will)).



As far as everything else, I think we are a "vibrant salad," getting more and more vibrant by the day. Obviously, we both have different life experiences.  I see people of all faiths (even if it is a faith that there is no faith) being blended in every day.  I also see conflict, though, like you do.  I think we have different views on *when* this country of ours got its start, and that's o.k.  I wish you the best, Yankeestarbuck, as I do those who think I'm so wrong that I don't know my head from a hole in the ground.  You're right.  It is the freedom afforded each of us in this country that makes it the best place to be.  Now, if we could just wave a magic wand and get everyone to use their freedom responsibly and open up to change on a daily basis, we'd really have it goin' on.

[gertilda]

Respectfully, GE, I don't believe in God.  And I don't *hope* that there isn't one because of his/her opinion of the human race.  I can't ignore the opinion of someone/something that I don't believe exists.  And I am not lying.  I am a spiritual person, but I believe in the mysteries of nature, rather than a being.



I realize that everyone has a different opinion, but I have been called "Evil" for my lack of belief.  I know that you were not implying anything by this post, and I didn't intend to post just to tell you "you're wrong", but please understand that people don't "lie" about their beliefs.  I feel very strongly about my beliefs, and anyone who believes as strongly as I do would not be lying when they tell you how they feel.

[goldenearring]

I was waiting for someone to reply similarly to what you did.  I'm not suprised, shocked, or outraged by differing opinions.  You are definitely not "evil" for your beliefs.  Anyone who would pop that out of their mouth had better take a closer look at their own character.  I'm sure it wasn't funny at the time it happened, but I think I would have said something similar to, "Well, if I'm 'evil,' what are you?!"  



I knew "lying" would be a strong word, but consider all the variations/shades/levels of "lying" that there are in the world (e.g. misinformation, withholding information, so-called "white lies," and so forth) and you may better understand what I was trying to say.  And, I realize what I have to say would be more palatable to more folks if I had the specifics on that study.  However, with or without the study, it's something that I've always believed, anyway.  



I respect that you say what you believe and feel is what you believe and feel, and I hope that you can respect that what I believe is that, at some level, whether they recognize it or not as of today, there is a hard-wire in all of us to acknowledge the existence of a Supreme Being.  I call Him God; others call Him Allah; others don't call Him anything at all, they just know He exists.  It takes different events for each of us, *I* believe, in order for that reality to get squeezed out of us.  I'd love to share my experience on why I believe the way I do, but it is far too personal for the boards, as I'm sure your experience is, too, Gertilda.  So, carry on ma'am, in this interesting world we are traveling through.